Refugee status cessation and PRs applying for citizenship

[rasmy]

Hi dpenabill can you expound on this case http://canlii.ca/t/gstsh? Does it mean the minister cannot suspend citizenship application in process while there is cessation case in process or to be determined?

 

[dpenabill]

Hi dpenabill can you expound on this case http://canlii.ca/t/gstsh? Does it mean the minister cannot suspend citizenship application in process while there is cessation case in process or to be determined?

Simple answer is NO.

If Justice Russell's decision had not been, in effect, overruled on further appeal, it would have meant that for this particular individual, and as to Nilam that is what Justice Russell ruled, that the suspension of Nilam's application was not allowed and IRCC was ordered (by writ of mandamus) to proceed with the application. Additionally the decision at least suggested that generally IRCC could not suspend processing the citizenship application pending a referral for cessation.

But, the Federal Court of Appeal did not agree with Justice Russell. So, NO, the contrary actually. See http://canlii.ca/t/h1s6l

Remember, in the meantime, Federal Court decisions are NOT binding precedent. Indeed, you might notice that in the decision you link Justice Russell expresses some consternation with CIC/IRCC failing to follow his previous ruling in the Godinez Ovalle case (see http://canlii.ca/t/gkgft ).

This was long a huge problem with citizenship law, various Federal Court Justices ruling one way, others another, leading to multiple and sometimes rather contradictory conclusions about what the law is (until June 2015 there were at least three separate and in some respects very different approaches to assessing residency, creating a huge mess that persisted for many, many years). Ultimately a Federal Court decision is only binding on the individual parties in that particular case. That said, the Federal Court rulings were mostly, usually, considered valid interpretations of the law, except to the extent there were conflicting rulings by different Federal Court justices.

Since 2014, however, further appeals to the Federal Court of Appeals have been available, for "certified questions," and decisions by the Federal Court of Appeals are binding precedent (unless there is a further appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada in the case and the Supreme Court decides otherwise).

And there was a certified question in the case you reference. The certified question was: "Can the Minister suspend the processing of an application for citizenship pursuant to his authority under s. 13.1 of the Citizenship Act, to await the results of cessation proceedings . . ."

And the Federal Court of Appeals basically said YES. Yes, the Minister can suspend processing the citizenship application. Again, see http://canlii.ca/t/h1s6l

 

[screech339]

Some people seem to be so jealous of refugees and special treatment of refugees, you'd think they'd love to be one themselves.

Why would I be jealous of refugee PR if their life is in danger in their country. They do deserve to have some special access to benefits but the price is that they cannot return to their home country. After all their life is supposedly in danger. That is why they are called refugees, are they not? I have no problems with refugees so long as they are bona fide refugees. The moment they return to home country as PR, they should not be called refugees. That is the price to pay if they want to have free benefits as refugees. This petition in the thread is asking to remove the cessation of PR due to returning home to native country. Isn't that defeat the purpose of having a Refugee PR?

Let take someone running from country over a blood feud as a example. That person can be considered to be refugee since his / her life is in danger if the person remained in the country. Do you think that those wanting blood will say "He is a Canadian PR, we won't kill him now." No, they still want him dead. That is why bona fide refugees would never go back to home country for life even as Canadian. Thats why refugees who went back to home country as Canadian can leave a bad taste among those who believe refugees are taking advantage of Canada's generosity.

 

[Seym]

Situations change. People who had valid reasons to leave a country as refugees and who became PRs sometimes see that the danger they face disappeared. They no longer need Canada's protection but in the meantime build a life here and are on the path to become citizens.
They are PRs just like you and I are/were and became so genuinely and should be treated as such, regardless of how they got that status.

Also, giving more importance to that "bad taste" in your -and others- mouths than someone else's life is a special kind of entitlement.
Do you really consider it normal to tell someone who was a refugee for a good reason, didn't "play the system" but no longer faces a life threatening danger in his home country and is now a PR or a Canadian not to visit his family ?
Bad taste requires toothpaste, not cruelty and rigid legalism.

 

[derin1010]

After been scared and worried about cessation or re-availment . I finally became canadian on the 19th June 2018.
Thank you dpenabill for your indept understand and advice.
To God be the glory

 

[sopranotb]

After been scared and worried about cessation or re-availment . I finally became canadian on the 19th June 2018.
Thank you dpenabill for your indept understand and advice.
To God be the glory

Hey tons of congratssssssssssss..
Can you share with us if you only renewed passport or visited home country too?

Congratss again and thanks for sharing good news..

 

[nofrills]

Situations change. People who had valid reasons to leave a country as refugees and who became PRs sometimes see that the danger they face disappeared. They no longer need Canada's protection but in the meantime build a life here and are on the path to become citizens.
They are PRs just like you and I are/were and became so genuinely and should be treated as such, regardless of how they got that status.

Also, giving more importance to that "bad taste" in your -and others- mouths than someone else's life is a special kind of entitlement.
Do you really consider it normal to tell someone who was a refugee for a good reason, didn't "play the system" but no longer faces a life threatening danger in his home country and is now a PR or a Canadian not to visit his family ?
Bad taste requires toothpaste, not cruelty and rigid legalism.

Yep, this troll seems to come out with particular vehemence against refugees - it's an obvious bias to pick when you don't see the same level of enthusiastic scrutiny and angry rhetoric applied to other type of immigrants whose behavior, situation and intentions might change once they migrate. You've gotta wonder where they picked it up - or maybe not really worth the time to engage.

 

[LadyA]

After been scared and worried about cessation or re-availment . I finally became canadian on the 19th June 2018.
Thank you dpenabill for your indept understand and advice.
To God be the glory

YAAYYYY!!!!!! Congrats!!!

 

[ImageOfLight]

After been scared and worried about cessation or re-availment . I finally became canadian on the 19th June 2018.
Thank you dpenabill for your indept understand and advice.
To God be the glory

YES!!!!!!!
Congratulations. I'll drink a toast to you.

 

[ImageOfLight]

Yep, this troll seems to come out with particular vehemence against refugees - it's an obvious bias to pick when you don't see the same level of enthusiastic scrutiny and angry rhetoric applied to other type of immigrants whose behavior, situation and intentions might change once they migrate. You've gotta wonder where they picked it up - or maybe not really worth the time to engage.

Unfortunately there is quite some vitriol directed at Ref.-PR in various forums here. I have learned to ignore the comments and focus on people with more substantive messages. I'd advise you to do the same.

 

[dpenabill]

After been scared and worried about cessation or re-availment . I finally became canadian on the 19th June 2018.
Thank you dpenabill for your indept understand and advice.
To God be the glory

Congratulations.

I concur in the request for a little more information about why you were worried about potential cessation.

What is most relevant is whether or not there was travel to the home country, and if so, some general description about how often and for how long. No need to reveal personal or particular details. Just general contextual information. Multiple trips? Brief or for more than a month or two sometimes? Just a general idea.

So if you will provide a little more info that would be much appreciated. Thank you.

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Note: as I posted about a week ago, the majority of cessation cases are triggered by a PoE examination in which CBSA becomes aware of the PR-refugee's home country passport or that the PR is returning to Canada from the home country.

Part of what makes this issue so heart-wrenching and unjust is that the risks are largely unknown. Many if not most PR-refugees were not made aware that they were risking their status by traveling home. And now, after having done so and finding out there is a risk of cessation, few if any know how big the risk is.

Not knowing is cruel. It is like having a biopsy for cancer and not getting the results for months and months going on years.

Those who have traveled home know they are at some risk. There is enough information available to be optimistic that despite some home country travel, that risk might be fairly small so long as they did not spend a lot of time or were not working or such in the home country. Beyond that it has been very difficult, if not impossible, to even guess how much the risk is.

I should have noticed and mentioned, sooner, that how things have gone at the PoE upon returning to Canada could be a significant clue. A lengthy examination including questions about a trip to the home country, for example, would be a big clue that CBSA or IRCC has taken notice and is paying attention, that the risk of cessation is higher . . . indeed, it could signal that CBSA is reviewing the case to decide whether or not to pursue cessation. A lengthy examination in itself does not signal what the decision will be. It could still go either way. But it does signal the PR-refugee is, so to say, spotted-on-the-radar, and the risk of cessation proceedings is higher.

What I wonder is the converse: if never having been challenged, in a PoE examination, about travel to the home country, if this might be a GOOD sign a problem is not likely?

In my post a week ago I cited and linked some cases in which it was clear that the cessation issue arose during the citizenship application process. But that does not illuminate how or why cessation arose in the particular case . . . with some exceptions. One of the exceptions, in a case I linked, was a case in which it appeared that a PoE examination while the citizenship application was in process probably triggered the cessation action.

In any event, it warrants REMINDING those in this situation: NO MORE travel to the home country unless and until AFTER citizenship is granted. I'd guess that traveling to the home country while a citizenship application is in process would be particularly unwise . . . not necessarily fatal but undoubtedly increasing the risk unnecessarily.

 

[LadyA]

This long and stressful journey is coming to a end. I received the notice to appear to take the oath. What a journey! What a journey!
For the past 5 hours, I've been trying to write this post. But I can't find my words. So I'll try to make it shot: thank you. thank you. From Dpenabill (thank you for your detailed answers. I really appreciated. And wow, your english!! Wow), to ImageOfLight (keep hope alive, your turn is coming). Last but not least, Sopranotb (I dont even know that to say. May God bless you.)
Today I'm not celebrating. I am relieved. But I am not happy. I'm waiting for you guys.

 

[lonleyplanet1995]

This long and stressful journey is coming to a end. I received the notice to appear to take the oath. What a journey! What a journey!
For the past 5 hours, I've been trying to write this post. But I can't find my words. So I'll try to make it shot: thank you. thank you. From Dpenabill (thank you for your detailed answers. I really appreciated. And wow, your english!! Wow), to ImageOfLight (keep hope alive, your turn is coming). Last but not least, Sopranotb (I dont even know that to say. May God bless you.)
Today I'm not celebrating. I am relieved. But I am not happy. I'm waiting for you guys.

it sound like you are winning an Oscar
congrats all the best

 

[ImageOfLight]

Congratulations LadyA. What a way to start a long weekend. I'll also drink a toast to you.

 

[sopranotb]

Congrats to the dearest LadyA - aka Lady Gaga all the best luck in your future life..